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{{Forumheader|Arena}}
 
{{Forumheader|Arena}}
   
<!-- Please put your content under this paragraph. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~
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[[User:Fan\\sign|fan\\sign]] 20:33, March 3, 2011 (UTC) The basic question I would
  +
like to debate is whether the
  +
Tsukasa & Subaru relationship
  +
has homosexual/bisexual tendencies,
  +
or if was meant to be something else.
  +
  +
My formal arguement concerning my position
  +
P1) Tsukasa & Subaru are either
  +
exclusively a heterosexual couple of the
  +
same gender or exclusively a bisexual couple.
  +
  +
P2) The individuals in a bisexual couple
  +
would be vague about which gender are
  +
their sexual preferences over time (though
  +
not about the person when they are in the relationship).
  +
  +
P3) Individuals in a couple whose
  +
sexual preferences are clearly defined
  +
over time yet ambiguously applied to the
  +
two sets of genders would a heterosexual
  +
couple of the same gender.
  +
  +
P4) Tsukasa & Subaru’s sexual preference
  +
are clearly defined over time yet
  +
ambiguously applied to the two sets
  +
of genders.
  +
______________________________________
  +
C1) Tsukasa & Subaru are a heterosexual
  +
couple of the same gender and not a
  +
bisexual couple.
  +
  +
In my understanding, Tsukasa's and
  +
Subaru's sexual preferences are
  +
clearly defined as always heterosexual
  +
for the gender they think Tsukasa is
  +
at the time. Their preferences are
  +
ambigously applied to the two sets
  +
of genders because Tsukasa has an
  +
ambigous understanding of his/her
  +
gender. After Tsukasa returns to
  +
the real world, his understanding
  +
would be much less ambiguous.
  +
However, I believe that a small
  +
part of An is still attached
  +
to I=male, because he understood
  +
this when he formed a relationship
  +
with Subaru, and could not exit
  +
this relationship, and therefore
  +
Tsukasa=male, without denying
  +
himself completely (which would
  +
have caused him to bend before
  +
Morganna). Their relationship,
  +
which I assert to be
  +
romantic, would in this theory
  +
be a romantic relationship
  +
between Subaru and An as far
  +
as she still holds to I=male,
  +
which was the impression I got
  +
from the end of "Return." But
  +
was the show truly intending it
  +
this, or were they intending it
  +
to be homosexual/bisexual? It
  +
seems possible to me, because
  +
of the degree of nuance they
  +
were willing to put into Sign,
  +
but I cannot be sure.
  +
I would like to know whether
  +
the general public and the
  +
canonical evidence (such as
  +
in .hack\\Zero, which I not
  +
read, but which I know
  +
contains information about
  +
their relationship in general)
  +
agrees with me. If you can
  +
debunk the logic of my arguement,
  +
or the truth of Premise 4
  +
(especially with information
  +
from .hack\\zero), I would
  +
appreciate you debating this
  +
with me.
  +
  +
P.S. If the creators of .hack
  +
have openly and directly asserted
  +
anything about this subject, please
  +
let me know. But if they haven't yet
  +
done anything directly, the debate
  +
should be kept as open as possible,
  +
since this view requires a degree of
  +
nuance to be held to and the creator
  +
may not have fully expressed it
  +
anywhere because of this. The evidence
  +
I am looking for is a nuanced analysis
  +
of their relationship which debunks or
  +
upholds my own. (My own is limited to
  +
Sign and what I can gather from
  +
Wikipedia's article on Zero).<!-- Please put your content under this paragraph. Be sure to sign your edits with four tildes ~~~~
   
 
~~~~ The basic question I would
 
~~~~ The basic question I would
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Sign and what I can gather from
 
Sign and what I can gather from
 
Wikipedia's article on Zero). -->
 
Wikipedia's article on Zero). -->
  +
  +
[[User:Fan\\sign|fan\\sign]] 22:17, March 3, 2011 (UTC) I also believe that Tsukasa & Subaru are not supposed to be completely unconscious of the (supposed) fact that their relationship exist because An still believes in part that I=male. Though they would hardly bring it up in conversation, this is what I got out of their looks and words (plus the etheral background music) in "Return". The constraints of this debate are that you must either show that this point-blank contradicts my earlier stance on their relationship, or you must assent to its being part of my argument - don't simply refuse it out of dislike, because I want to know the cannonical position on this, not your private fanon version on it.

Latest revision as of 22:17, March 3, 2011

BBS: Index > Arena > The nature of Tsukasa&Subaru's relationship:Bisexual v.something else

fan\\sign 20:33, March 3, 2011 (UTC) The basic question I would

like to debate is whether the Tsukasa & Subaru relationship has homosexual/bisexual tendencies, or if was meant to be something else.

My formal arguement concerning my position P1) Tsukasa & Subaru are either exclusively a heterosexual couple of the same gender or exclusively a bisexual couple.

P2) The individuals in a bisexual couple would be vague about which gender are their sexual preferences over time (though not about the person when they are in the relationship).

P3) Individuals in a couple whose sexual preferences are clearly defined over time yet ambiguously applied to the two sets of genders would a heterosexual couple of the same gender.

P4) Tsukasa & Subaru’s sexual preference are clearly defined over time yet ambiguously applied to the two sets of genders. ______________________________________ C1) Tsukasa & Subaru are a heterosexual couple of the same gender and not a bisexual couple.

In my understanding, Tsukasa's and Subaru's sexual preferences are clearly defined as always heterosexual for the gender they think Tsukasa is at the time. Their preferences are ambigously applied to the two sets of genders because Tsukasa has an ambigous understanding of his/her gender. After Tsukasa returns to the real world, his understanding would be much less ambiguous. However, I believe that a small part of An is still attached to I=male, because he understood this when he formed a relationship with Subaru, and could not exit this relationship, and therefore Tsukasa=male, without denying himself completely (which would have caused him to bend before Morganna). Their relationship, which I assert to be romantic, would in this theory be a romantic relationship between Subaru and An as far as she still holds to I=male, which was the impression I got from the end of "Return." But was the show truly intending it this, or were they intending it to be homosexual/bisexual? It seems possible to me, because of the degree of nuance they were willing to put into Sign, but I cannot be sure. I would like to know whether the general public and the canonical evidence (such as in .hack\\Zero, which I not read, but which I know contains information about their relationship in general) agrees with me. If you can debunk the logic of my arguement, or the truth of Premise 4 (especially with information from .hack\\zero), I would appreciate you debating this with me.

P.S. If the creators of .hack have openly and directly asserted anything about this subject, please let me know. But if they haven't yet done anything directly, the debate should be kept as open as possible, since this view requires a degree of nuance to be held to and the creator may not have fully expressed it anywhere because of this. The evidence I am looking for is a nuanced analysis of their relationship which debunks or upholds my own. (My own is limited to Sign and what I can gather from Wikipedia's article on Zero).

fan\\sign 22:17, March 3, 2011 (UTC) I also believe that Tsukasa & Subaru are not supposed to be completely unconscious of the (supposed) fact that their relationship exist because An still believes in part that I=male. Though they would hardly bring it up in conversation, this is what I got out of their looks and words (plus the etheral background music) in "Return". The constraints of this debate are that you must either show that this point-blank contradicts my earlier stance on their relationship, or you must assent to its being part of my argument - don't simply refuse it out of dislike, because I want to know the cannonical position on this, not your private fanon version on it.

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