Talk:Epitaph of Twilight (Poem)

German epitaph
I noticed there isn't the "original" German epitaph on this page.... Shall I add it? (I could also make a word-to-word translation of this, since it would be a little bit different from the official english epitaph used in the games, at least in words, not in content). I'm talking about the part of the epitaph in the beginning of .hack/Infection, since this is, as far as I know, the only part that was German from the very beginning (I printed the whole epitaph in German some time ago from somewhere on the internet, but I think, most of it is translated from English). -- Milay 22:02, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm all for it. Analysis seemed to think including it was a good idea.  Just curious though, is it the same in the German version as in the English/Japanese versions?  I'd have thought they might have retranslated it... - Kuukai2 01:12, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
 * It is, since the German version used the English sounds/talks (can be changed to japanese later in the game I think (man I just noticed that it is quite some time since I last played those games)). However, I think the written text is slightly different from what is spoken. Alright, I'll take care of it =) - Milay 05:44, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Der Prolog zu .hack//Infection mit dem Gedicht von Emma Wieland: The prologue to .hack//Infection with the poem from Emma Wieland: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUiUT_ZSYbw

Geschrieben / Written: Der Mann mit Schatten ist auf der Suche nach dem Abenddrachen verreist und ist noch nicht zurück gekommen. Der Herd der Finsternis grollt. Helba, Königin der Finsternis, stellt schließlich ein Heer auf. Apeiron, König des Lichts, reagiert. Die Beiden treffen sich am Fuße des Regenbogens. Die verfluchte Welle muss gemeinsam bekämpft werden. Der See von Alba brodelt. Der große Baum des Lichts fällt. All Macht zerfällt zu Tropfen unter dem Tempel von Arche Köln. Wesen ohne Schatten, ihre Welt zerfällt zu Nichts. Der Mann mit Schatten, auf der Suche nach dem Abenddrachen, kehrt niemals mehr zurück.

Gesprochen / Spoken:<BR> Der Mann des Schattens, auf der Suche nach dem<BR> Abenddrachen, ist noch nicht zurückgekommen.<BR> Der Herd der Finsternis grollt.<BR> Helba, Königin der Finsternis, stellt schließlich ein Heer auf.<BR> Apeiron, König des Lichts, grüßt sie.<BR> Und sie treffen sich am Fuße des Regenbogens.<BR> Die verfluchte Welle muss gemeinsam bekämpft werden.<BR> Der See von Alba brodelt.<BR> Der große Baum des Lichts fällt.<BR> Alle Macht zerfällt zu Tropfen im Tempel von Arche Köln.<BR> Wesen ohne Schatten, ihre Welt zerfällt zu Nichts.<BR> Der Mann des Schattens, auf der Suche nach dem<BR> Abenddrachen, kehrt niemals mehr zurück.<BR>

In .hack//G.U. haben sie aus dem Gedicht sogar ein Lied gemacht: "Grima Lowe Cathedral" (manchmal auch Löwe geschrieben):<BR> The song "Grima Lowe Cathedral" from .hack//G.U. based on the poem:<BR> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BpYhA1a8h4

Der Mann mit Schatten ist auf<BR> der Such' nach dem Abenddrachen<BR> verreist und kommt noch nicht zurück.

Helba, Königin von Schatten stellt schließlich das Heer auf.<BR> Apeiron, König von Licht bewinkt.

Die verfluchte Welle ist gemeinsam zu bekämpfen.

By Thinuviel 139.20.164.48 17:04, 16 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Es gibt noch weitere Lieder mit Texten aus dem Epitaph, auf dem Soundtrack der ersten Spielereihe. Alle deutschen Liedtexte sind bereits auf den Seiten der jeweiligen Soundtracks =)

There are more songs with lyrics from the Epitaph. All German lyrics are on the soundtracks' sites =) - milay 18:37, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

There are more german songs? I haven't played the games yet, can you please tell me the titles? I only found "Das Wandern" yet. 139.20.164.48 08:25, 17 April 2009 (UTC)
 * I linked to them from my User page under "My contributions - lyrics" =) - milay 14:29, 17 April 2009 (UTC)

"Mia" Fragment
I've heard there's a part of the Epitaph, about the Pleiades, coming from something Mia says. Anyone know anything about this? - Kuukai2 03:36, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, I do know something about it. It's in volume 3 of Another Birth.  What do you want to know?  --Shinsou Wotan, 03:39, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, where it comes from is mainly it, since I wanted to confirm that. Also, is the "Epigraph" one legitimate or is it possibly fanmade? (within the series, of course) - Kuukai2 03:43, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I assume that by "Epigraph" you're referring to the Sheraton bit from Another Birth 2? I'd say it's as trustworthy as any fragment found in the series, and since it has a sort of in-The-World verification, it's probably real.  --Shinsou Wotan, 03:51, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
 * So is the wording sign or harbinger in the Tokyopop translation? We should keep the text as it is, but make notes.  Also, "Plaird" is only Bandai of Japan's fault, in the US games it's Pleiad. - Kuukai2 22:50, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * When Mia says it on page 123, it's "sign". When the fragment is repeated on page 177, it's "harbinger".  It should have been "sign" in both.  And are you sure it's "Pleiad" in the English games?  I could swear I've seen an English cutscene where it was "Plaird".  --Shinsou Wotan 23:19, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmm, you could very well be right, I only have the Japanese version. I assumed that the page was correctly named since it survived the scrutiny of everyone here.  Umm, can anyone check and make sure?  Youtube came up blank for credits in Vol. 2 or 3, and really the only thing we have indicating that it's "Plaird" is fuzzy recollection and Wikipedia's word for it...  Even their topmost .hack page has errors, so they're not much to go off of... - Kuukai2 23:47, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Anyone? - Kuukai2 19:39, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * http://homepage.mac.com/murgatroyd314/plaird.jpg
 * From one of the FMVs here. --Shinsou Wotan 20:09, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Now I feel dumb for settling on Youtube's results and not just Googling it. Thanks though. - Kuukai2 20:57, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Name
Isn't there a "the" in this thing's name? Or did I miss something? - Kuukai 07:10, 20 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm pretty sure it's just the "Epitaph of Twilight." I just checked Liminality 3 and the characters call it the "Epitaph of Twilight." Kulaguy 08:40, 20 June 2006 (UTC)


 * But at the very beginning of the games, when part of the Epitaph is read in German, doesn't it say "Epitaph of the Twilight" at the end? I'd think written would trump spoken, since talking is more casual, etc... And also, Liminality is translated, but that line in the intro is the same in all versions of the game.-Kuukai 02:24, 21 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Eh, I checked the video of that and it does indeed say the Epitaph of the Twilight. But, is there any proof that it was the same in the Japanese version of the game? I mean, how the heck would those Japanese people understand it if there was words in English and then sounds in German? Kulaguy 05:26, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
 * (This is Kuukai, I umm... forgot my password... ^^;) Well, for one thing I have the Japanese versions of the first four games and just checked. The English as well as the German gets subtitled in Japanese.  Perhaps Emma titled it in English...  If there's a way to extract the cutscenes, I could prove it if you really need me to.  Or I could borrow my friend's camera and take a picture of the screen...  They spell it that way on the official website (http://www.cyberconnect2.jp/hack/room/sora/sora.html) too - 206.221.232.213 06:18, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Is there any Japanese source that doesn't have the "The"? I've looked through everything I have, and I'm pretty sure there's always a "the", just like with "Key of the Twilight." Pretty sure we can put it down as a name change, and an inconsistent one at that... - Kuukai2 21:55, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Actual Epitaph
Whoever edited in that fake Epitaph, please stop. I know where you got that from and it isn't a reliable source. http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=589682&topic=26977923

Unless I have official proof and sources of the actual Epitaph, do not change it. Kulaguy 08:48, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

What about the little notes and things that you find throughout the course of the .hack games? Some of them seem to be Harald's development notes, but others seem more like Epitaph fragments. Should we include those here? --CRtwenty 19:15, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

um, dunnow if I'm right here.. I edited the Epitaph of Twilight because in my games it says 'wake' instead of 'Wave' at this point.. 'Riding the wake is Skeith' - thats what the mail 'Epitaph of Twilight' from Wiseman says.. I got it right before me now.. so I thought 'Wave' was a typo... -.- maybe some translation errors.. as far as I know the American version does not have the same translation as the European one.. sry for my english, I'm no native speaker <Askaya

Epitaph of Twilight accoring to Analysis...
I've noticed that according to Shinsou Wotan's translation of the "True" Epitaph that there are some glaring differences, should I put these up here? (with his express permission of course)
 * You mean the outline? It's not the "true" version, they're both legitimate pieces of the same puzzle, just a couple pages apart in Analysis.  There are some differences between the two parts, such as Bith's color, though we have a few theories about htis...  But yeah, the outline would be a great edition to this section.  I intend to translate the glossary of characters at some point too, which I'll add as well... - Kuukai2

Where?
All this info I haven't seen before, such as the two knight brigades being in the Epitaph... where's this info coming from? ~ Ichida
 * The information about the Crimson and Cobalt Knights comes from AI Buster 2. Albireo mentions how odd it is seeing the Crimson Knights giving information to the Cobalt Knights, since in the Epitaph they're mortal enemies. --CRtwenty 03:17, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Their colors are also used in the demon and holy arena titles in the Japanese version, with the third being "dragon sage", which I thought was interesting. - Kuukai2 03:55, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Cobalt and Crimson
My source for "dark" and "light" is page 71 of AI Buster 2. Where are you getting "demonic" and "holy"? 〈ザ・ワールド〉の世界観の基になった〈黄昏の碑文〉の物語では、碧衣と紅衣は、光と闇の、対をなす騎士団だと言う. --Shinsou Wotan, 22:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * From the arena, but if the book actually specified like that, then they are the knights of Light and Dark... It's cool that it's at least somewhat consistent with the arena names... - Kuukai2 23:08, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Depending on how you look at it "Demon" and "Dark", or "Light" and "Holy" could be seen as synonyms in certain situations. --CRtwenty 23:18, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Epitaph 03
In this fragment-Wave soars and shrouds the eyes. No means to fight an omnipresent force, The shadowless ones just grieve. Why must it be a Wave? Divide, if it would just... Then retaliate, we may. the omnipresent force refers to Morganna?--Kite X 16:35, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Well duh... they directly refer to Morganna as the Cursed Wave in the games. --CRtwenty 17:00, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Harald's Copy
In Liminality Episode 3 Kyoko mentions a rumor that one obsessed fan transcribed the entire Epitaph of Twilight by hand. Knowing how crazy Harald was with Emma it seems fairly likely that he was this fan. It would explain how he got a complete copy. --CRtwenty 18:25, 25 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Of course Of course....--Kite X 18:45, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Shadowless Ones
In this part of the poem do the shadowless ones refer to the other .hackers? Wave soars and shrouds the eyes. No means to fight an omnipresent force, The shadowless ones just grieve. Why must it be a Wave? Divide, if it would just... Then retaliate, we may. --70.136.26.214 01:02, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I took the shadowless ones to mean the sprites in the Epitaph. In the context of the game, it'd probably refer to the Vagrant AIs.--SicInfit 02:06, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

Epitaph
So... I'm curious as to if all of this is supposed to be read together or in parts. I mean, perhaps it's because I'm so tired, but fo some reason, reading all of them in order doesn't make sense to me. I don't mean to sound like i'm totally lost-- i'm seriously wiped-- I was just wondering if anyone could clarify this.

If it's already on here... Then.. oops my bad. O= Sorry. (name's Kaiho btw)
 * The Epitaph is a novel-length poem, most of which has been lost. What you see in this article is just a few of the remaining bits and pieces. --Shinsou Wotan 02:32, 8 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah, there is no known copy of the complete text. Only fragments. --CRtwenty 04:47, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Ah sou ka. Arigatou gozaimasu then ^^; -bows-

Translating
Has anyone read the German version? Or have it? Or something? The german teacher at my school (who sponsors my anime club) would be interested in it. I would like to show him the actual German one if anyone has it.

~Kaiho (ps, if anyone wants to roleplay at all-- I know I pro'lly shouldn't post this-- but go ahead and email me)


 * As far as I know, I don't think there is an actual German version, aside from that bit from the beginning of INFECTION. In-story, it was originally written in German and then translated to Japanese by fans. --Biccy 20:24, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Ah.. sou desu ka? Hm, thanks then. I'll just give what I've got to my teacher. ^_^

<Sure there is a german version since the game has been published in germany too. so here it is (I copy every dot as it stands in Wiseman's mail, so I'm not responseable for grammatical errors.. ; ) )

- Epitaph des Zwielicht -

Verdammniswelle von unbekannter Herkunft... Als die Sterne über den Himmel ziehen. Der Horizont sich verdunkelt die Luft mit Klagen sich füllt. Da kommt aus dem erwählten Land hinter dem Wald ein Zeichen. Auf dieser Welle reitet Skeith. Schatten des Todes. zu begraben. was noch steht. Trugbild der Täuschung. Innis. mit aller Macht der Illusionen. betrügt und der Welle hilft. Durch die Macht des Magus wird ein Tropfen gen Himmel geschleudert. zu erschaffen eine neue Welle. Mit der Welle: Fidtchell und die Macht der dunklen Vorhersehung: die Hoffnung sinkt. Trauer und Verzweiflung regieren. Gorres dunkle Pläne, verschluckt von der Verdammniswelle. Macha setzt verführerische Fallen. Die Welle bricht. und niemand kann entkommen. Tarvos regiert mit grausamer Bestrafung und Vernichtung. Und nach dieser Apokalypse. nach der Welle. nur noch Leere. Und aus dem Abgrund dieser Leere erhebt sich Corbenik. Dem Kataklysmus dieser Welle wohnt vielleicht ein Anfang inne.

<Askaya

Twilight Dragon
"The Twilight Dragon cannot talk, but instead, it speaks to your heart. If the will to be rid of the Cursed Wave is strong enough, the Twilight Dragon will destroy it, but if it isn't, then it will not." Is there a source for this bit? If so, where? --Shinsou Wotan 02:18, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
 * CR said it was in Liminality, but I just skimmed it and couldn't immediately figure out where. If someone could point out the exact scene, that would be great. - Kuukai2 03:05, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
 * For that matter, where was the website "security measure" mentioned? It seems contradicted by at least one scene in Liminality... - Kuukai2 03:15, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
 * The security measure that prevents saving and copy-pasting is mentioned in AI Buster. --Shinsou Wotan 02:04, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It's from that stupid North American Liminality Easter Egg, not any of the actual animation parts. --AuraTwilight 19:49, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
 * By which I meant to say the Dragon talking to one's heart. Sorry. --AuraTwilight 00:57, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Something I though of a long time ago just came back to my mind..... The original German epitaph used the word "Abenddrache" for Twilight dragon. "Drache" (in plural or under some grammar circumstances also written "Drachen") means dragon. However, there's also the German word "Drachen" (singular) which means "kite"...... Could just be a coincidence, but could also be an intended pun. What do you think? -- Milay 21:58, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure it's just a coincidence, but which "kite" does it mean? The bird or the toy? - Kuukai2 01:12, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
 * The toy (I wasn't arawe there's a bird named Kite, too) =) - 84.189.243.194 - Milay 05:43, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Tenses in "Phases of the wave" section
Are the tenses actually translated that way? They don't seem consistent, switching between past and present. (E.g. "Mirage of Deceit, Innis, Betray all with the flawed image, and did aid the Wave." Betray is used here in present tense, without an "s". is that really correct? I'm pretty sure it's betrays or betrayed.) --~Seraph~ 14:18, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Epitaph 01 notes
I noticed something concerning Epitaph 01. It currently reads:

<I>When the finger points to the yonder moon, The fool will not look at the fingertip.</I>

In the other notes section, it states the English version of .hack has mistranslated the line from the original Japanese and it <I>should</I> read <I>"The fool will look at the fingertip"</I>.

What I'm unclear is if the poem is reflecting the mistranlated English version (because that is what is given in the game) and the note is reflecting the actual translation of the Japanese version of Epitaph 01 or if the error is in the note, in which it should state "The Japanese version reads "The fool will look at the fingertip." 24.84.218.226 19:38, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, the section that begins, "Once their magic land did glow" is written by a fan. Can someone either provide me with a canon source for that long, long section or remove it?

131.229.145.30 19:49, October 6, 2016 (UTC)Foehn